atarionline.pl Rockford on Atari 800XL - Forum Atarum

Jeśli chcesz wziąć udział w dyskusjach na forum - zaloguj się. Jeżeli nie masz loginu - poproś o członkostwo.

  • :
  • :

Vanilla 1.1.4 jest produktem Lussumo. Więcej informacji: Dokumentacja, Forum.

    • 1: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime2 Oct 2010
     
    Я так понял, что если я напишу по-русски, меня тут поймут. Если необходимо, потом переведу на английский. Или кто-нибудь, кто знает русский, переведет мое сообщение на польский, буду благодарен :) Конечно, если в том есть необходимость.

    У меня есть вопрос по игре "Rockford" на Atari 800XL. В начале 90-х играл в нее на консоле (на самой приставке игровой), потом, в 2007-м, на эмуляторе. Оба раза доходил до 9-го уровня (9th level), а его пройти не могу. Во-первых, не успеваю, совсем мало времени. Во-вторых, что гораздо важнее, там не хватает камней (gems). Уже когда заканчивалось время, я их пересчитывал, и было недостаточно.
    Есть видеопрохождение этой игры -
    Тут она записана до 7-го уровня. Человек, который сделал это прохождение, сказал мне, что тоже доходил до 9-го уровня и не смог его пройти по тем же причинам. Он думает, что там баг (ошибка), потому пройти этот уровень невозможно. Но я в этом не уверен. Может быть, кто-нибудь знает и подскажет?

    Речь идет именно о версии для Atari 800XL, потому что в других версиях, насколько я знаю, такой проблемы нет.
    • 2:
       
      CommentAuthorKaz
    • CommentTime2 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    Nie trzeba tlumaczyc na angielski, bo wiekszosc 30-latkow, ktorzy to czytaja, miala w szkole rosyjski, niech sobie przypominaja :D

    W skrocie: chodzi o to, ze "Rockforda" na Atari XL nie daje sie przejsc, problemem jest 9 plansza. Po pierwsze dlatego, ze jest za malo czasu, ale co wazniejsze - jest za malo kamieni do zebrania. Nawet facet, ktory robil ten filmik z YT powiedzial, ze nie mogl przejsc 9 planszy i ze to jest chyba bug w wersji Atari (bo w innych wersjach jest okey).

    Pytanie - czy ktos umie przejsc/przeszedl dalej?
    • 3: CommentAuthorJacques
    • CommentTime2 Oct 2010
     
    Jako 30-latek muszę wyrazić sprzeciw ;-) Ja w szkole nie miałem nigdy rosyjskiego, na szczęście tłukli mi od razu angielski do głowy :-)
    • 4: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime2 Oct 2010
     
    "Jako 30-latek muszę wyrazić sprzeciw ;-) Ja w szkole nie miałem nigdy rosyjskiego, na szczęście tłukli mi od razu angielski do głowy :-) "

    I'll speak may be better English for everyone here inderstand me :)
    • 5: CommentAuthorJacques
    • CommentTime2 Oct 2010
     
    Sure :-) I guess English will be much easier for most of people :-)
    • 6:
       
      CommentAuthorKaz
    • CommentTime2 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    Jezeli dobrze pamietam, dopiero w okolicy roku 1990 rosyjski przestal byc powszechny, zarowno w szkolach podstawowych jak i srednich. Wiec jesli sie nie zalapales na rosyjski, a tylko angielski/niemiecki - to Twoja strata ;D
    • 7: CommentAuthorJacques
    • CommentTime2 Oct 2010
     
    Moja, nie przeczytam Mistrza i Małgorzaty w oryginale, poza tym da się bez niego żyć :D Pierwszy język rozpoczął mi się bodajże w 5 klasie podstawówki i od razu był to angielski, uff :-)
    • 8:
       
      CommentAuthorKaz
    • CommentTime2 Oct 2010
     
    U mnie nauczycielka rosyjskiego przekwalifikowala sie na nauczycielke angielskiego... :D
    • 9: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime2 Oct 2010
     
    It looks like this topic isn't about Rockford but about languages )
    • 10: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime3 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    This is the level I spoke about:

    ->link<-
    ->link<-
    • 11: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime6 Oct 2010
     
    I know now. It's a bug. Some versions of Rockford have this bug. Because of it this level can be never completed...
    • 12:
       
      CommentAuthorKaz
    • CommentTime6 Oct 2010
     
    Some versions of Rockford have this bug.


    Do you mean "some Atari versions" or "some computer version"?
    • 13: CommentAuthorzoltan
    • CommentTime6 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    Może to chodzi o to samo, co w Boulder Dash w którejś planszy? (wersja NTSC odpalona na PAL?)
    • 14:
       
      CommentAuthorKrótki
    • CommentTime6 Oct 2010
     
    Raczej nie, gra jest z Wielkiej Brytanii.

    Równie dobrze może być to wina złego cracka. Ma ktoś oryginał na kasecie, żeby zdumpować?
    • 15: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime7 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    "Do you mean "some Atari versions" or "some computer version"?"

    Some versions in the whole. There is no bug on Spectrum but we can see it on Сommodore-64. The original game was on arcade automat and for many versions on different computers the programm code was written absouluty like it was on Arcadia. May be that bug came from there. But for some versions (e.g. version for Spectrum) the code was underworked and may be they took that bug away during this process.
    • 16:
       
      CommentAuthormiker
    • CommentTime7 Oct 2010
     
    According to Atarimania info (here: ->link<- it seems that original version has this bug as well (some of Mastertronic games are not finishable/bugged to, ie. Colony). Maybe the key is to change diamond quota to lower one and it will probably kill all troubles. :)
    • 17:
       
      CommentAuthorKrótki
    • CommentTime7 Oct 2010
     
    Yes, it's probable (Colony is from the same Icon Design team). But that comment at Atarimania, the guy didn't mention if he was running the cassette original, did he?
    • 18: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime7 Oct 2010
     
    "here: ->link<"

    It doesn't open :(

    "Maybe the key is to change diamond quota to lower one and it will probably kill all troubles. :)"

    How to do it?
    • 19:
       
      CommentAuthorKaz
    • CommentTime7 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    It doesn't open :(


    It does, when you will remove ")," from adress, accidentaly added by Miker. This is correct one:

    ->link<-
  1.  
    Well,
    this is the sad side of Mastertronic games, a lot of them do have bugs (which make them unfinishable) on the A8:

    - Universal Hero: the game gives you a password, but at the end, when you have to tpye it in, it dos not accept this password. Solution: Copy the tape to disk, then use a disk/sector editor and change some bytes, so it will accept any kind of password (such a version is available at Fandal and other sites)...

    - Colony: When you order new supplies and leave the beacon activated, then as soon as you go to the landing site (of the supplies) you get garbage all over the screen and this garbage continues to all screens you enter. Reason: The game is not fully finished and not fully assembled, it contains ASM sourcecode inside the program. Afaik someone at atari-age is working on a big bugfix...

    - Rockford: One cannot solve level 9, since there are not enough diamonds to collect and there is not enough time to finish the level. Well, for the last one, there is an easy solution: When in level 9, activate the Pause mode, then press Reset and now you have unlimited time (this works for all Rockford levels afaik). How to correct the diamond bug ? Well, I don`t know, you need a disk/sector editor for sure and have to change some bytes...

    Afaik, there are more buggy Mastertronic games, but I do not remember their names (or bugs) right now... -Andreas Koch.
    • 21: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime7 Oct 2010
     
    "When in level 9, activate the Pause mode, then press Reset and now you have unlimited time (this works for all Rockford levels afaik)"

    I can't to this. I make pause mode then press "reset". Pause mode stays. I make it (pause state) off and the game shuts down. How to do that what you said?
    • 22:
       
      CommentAuthorKaz
    • CommentTime8 Oct 2010
     
    offtopic:

    Moja, nie przeczytam Mistrza i Małgorzaty w oryginale, poza tym da się bez niego żyć :D Pierwszy język rozpoczął mi się bodajże w 5 klasie podstawówki i od razu był to angielski, uff :-)


    A jednak jestes w mniejszosci :P

    ->link<-
    • 23:
       
      CommentAuthormiker
    • CommentTime8 Oct 2010
     
    @Petenokor: So play level 9 normally but remember to write down how many diamonds/gems/whatever can you get, and then we'll ask some coder to patch the game.
    • 24: CommentAuthorw1k
    • CommentTime8 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    ->link<-

    ->link<-

    ->link<-

    rockford on msdos :) and many atari conversions
    • 25: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime8 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    "@Petenokor: So play level 9 normally but remember to write down how many diamonds/gems/whatever can you get, and then we'll ask some coder to patch the game. "

    I can already tell it. There are 54 gems but I need to collect 60 to complete 9th level. So there must be 6 gems more. And there is may be to less of time - only 96 seconds.
    • 26:
       
      CommentAuthormiker
    • CommentTime8 Oct 2010
     
    And what about other platforms? how much time and gem threshold?
    • 27: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime8 Oct 2010
     
    "And what about other platforms? how much time and gem threshold?"

    On Spectrum there are 120 seconds and you need to collect only 10 gems (and there are 51 of them in the level).
    • 28: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime10 Oct 2010
     
    For everybody who understand Russian (or use electrinic translater).

    One guy said that promble might be get out by this:

    "использовать монитор в эмуляторе, cделать дампы памяти, найти ячейку памяти отвечающую за количество собраных алмазов и поставить там что надо".

    Does anyone know how to do this?
    • 29:
       
      CommentAuthorKrótki
    • CommentTime11 Oct 2010
     
    Here's the fixed version, with amount of gems changed to 30 (like in the PC version).

    It's not possible to change the amount of time only for level 9 - it's 99 for all levels.
    • 30: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime11 Oct 2010
     
    Krótki
    Wow! Thanks! I can't believe that I completed 9th level! :) Thank you very much! Did you make this fixing?
    • 31: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime11 Oct 2010
     
    Oh, one more problam... Not bug now. I can't complete 12th level. To less of time. I don't know how to collect 50 gems and open the way to exit in 99 seconds. Here is the screenshot:



    I have an idea. In this level there is something (in black round on the screenshot):



    It looks like a clock. I think it gives extra nime. But. In one of the privious level there was a clock but I couldn't take it. That's time it wasn't very important. I played Spectrum version and there I could take clock and it gave me some extra time. So I'm afraid that it's one more bug in Atari version - Rockford can't take the clock. And on 12th level it is needed to take it. But I'm not sure. May be someone tolds me the solution. It would be very nice :)
    But if it is bug we have one more situation to change the number of needed gems :)
    • 32:
       
      CommentAuthorKrótki
    • CommentTime11 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    Yes, I did it, with the help of Atari800's built-in monitor.

    Also, note the invisible, uneatable item in the bottom-right corner of the coin area. In the PC version, there's a normal coin instead.

    It would be beneficial if someone played through the Atari version side-by-side with some other version (f.e. Amiga) - there may be other errors in the game.

    There's an interesting discussion at ->link<- about existence of the same bug in the C64 version.
    • 33:
       
      CommentAuthorKrótki
    • CommentTime11 Oct 2010
     
    Petenokor, try checking out if the "can't take clock" bug also exists in the C64 version, and if not, then how much time it adds when taken.
    • 34: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime11 Oct 2010
     
    "Also, notice the invisible, uneatable item in the bottom-right corner of the coin area"

    I didn't understand. Where is it? What kind of item?

    "Yes, I did it, with the help of Atari800's built-in monitor"

    Can you explane me how it is to do it?
    • 35: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime11 Oct 2010
     
    I understood. Invicible object on 9th level. Yeah it is there.
    • 36: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime11 Oct 2010
     
    Yeah I have earlier thought that this invisible object must be used to get 6 coins. May be it's really a big secret but I think it's a bug. I did some things with that object but it didn't give coins. And I don't think that for Atari and C64 versions programmers made some super secret in level. May be it's the same error in code that came from one console to another. How do you think?
    • 37:
       
      CommentAuthorKrótki
    • CommentTime12 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    > "Yes, I did it, with the help of Atari800's built-in monitor"

    > Can you explane me how it is to do it?

    1. Run the game's first level. Number of coins to get is 40 = $28.

    2. Run the monitor by pressing F8.

    3. Enter
    > tss 28
    This causes the monitor to "remember" all addresses with value 40.

    4. Go back to the game by entering
    > cont

    5. Take one coin, so that number of coins to get changes to 39 = $27.

    6. Run the monitor again (F8).

    7. Enter
    > tsc 27
    This finds all addresses in which the value changed from 40 to 39. In this case, the found address is 00A8.

    8. Now you can try if the found value is the right one; change it to f.e. 20 = $14:
    > c 00a8 14

    9. Go back to the game to verify that the number of gems has changed.
    > cont

    This way, I've found the location in which the current number of coins is stored. The next step was to:

    10. Find code which causes change of the 00a8 address. I did that by searching for the STA $A8 opcode in the whole memory:
    > s 0000 ffff 85 a8
    I was lucky, there were only three such locations: 43B5, A3B5, E74C

    11. Set a breakpoint in each of the found addresses. By setting the breakpoint I found that the instruction at E74C is called on level restart - clearly a moment when the number of coins is being reset to its initial value.
    > bpc e74c
    > cont
    <<restart the level in-game>>

    12. Show last 64 instructions executed.
    > h
    By analysing the output I've found out that the number of coins is read from location FFBF+<level number>, where <level number> is started at 0.

    13. Show contents of memory from address FFBF
    > m ffbf

    14. Find where the values at FFBF are in the game's binary. I did that by opening Rockford (v2).xex in a hex editor and searching for these values. I found that numbers of coins to get at each level are stored in that xex file starting at offset 99BE.

    15. Modify the value for level 9. Presto!

    > May be it's the same error in code that came from one console to another. How do you think?

    Yes I think that's a bug (in level data, not in code) common for both versions. I'm curious whether the "can't take clock" bug has also came from C64.
    • 38: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime12 Oct 2010
     
    Krótki
    I watched. There is the same on C64 - I can't take a clock. May be it's a bug? And I think I need you again to fix level 12th - make for example only 15 gems to collect. Cause an idea of this level mat be: you need to go to the clock, take it and get out from the dangerous place where it is. In this case you have enough time to collect all gems. But clock is untaken so... Fix it, ok? :)
    • 39: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime12 Oct 2010
     
    Oh... According to your instructions I can easy make only 1 gem needed in each level. But in the 12th level there is other problem. It's to less time to open the way to exit. I guess we have to stop the time someway...
    • 40:
       
      CommentAuthorKrótki
    • CommentTime12 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    Current time left is stored at location AA. If it's getting close to 0, go to the monitor and reset its value to 99:
    > c aa 63

    I've checked the PC version. In there, you can take the clock; it adds 20 seconds.
    • 41: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime12 Oct 2010
     
    20 seconds? Hm... It's not to much. If in Atari version there were only 20 seconds with a clock it would change nothing. But may be it was planned to add more time in Atari version. If not I don't understand how to collect 50 gems and open the way to exit in 99 seconds (I mean how it is in the normal variant of the level). May be it's just to difficult? But I thins it's really impossible. How do you think?
    • 42: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime12 Oct 2010
     
    Krótki
    Thank you very and very much! I complete that level by making the timer "99". Thank you for all!
    • 43: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime12 Oct 2010
     
    There is a clock in the 18th level. And if it gives 20 seconds may be it's impossible to complete level too. May be it was planned to give much more in Atari version. What ever I use yor instruction to set timer "99" cause clock is untaken.
    • 44: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime12 Oct 2010
     
    Oh, my God! I thought there were no more bugs that could stop me. But I think I found one. And I don't know how to pass it. I have endless time I can make only one gem needed to collect but in this situation it can't help.

    If I count right it's the 19th level. In this level there are two or more clocks. 99 seconds aren't enough that's why you must make everything quick and take these clocks. As we know we can't take it in Atari version. But it's not a problem we can make timer "99" everytime. But there is another problem. Look here:



    I need to get to the area that is higher than Rockford stands. But I can't because clock is on my way. And I can't take it so I can't go throug it! I don't know what I can do in this situation. May be no cheat can help.
    • 45: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime15 Oct 2010
     
    Krótki

    May be there is some way to begin the game from every level? I mean we can do something to make game begins not on the first level but on some other? And this way we can pass level 19 with its fatal bug and begin on the 20th level.
    • 46:
       
      CommentAuthorKrótki
    • CommentTime15 Oct 2010
     
    Yes, there is! I've once found a location that holds current level number, although I don't remember it right now. Can you try to find that location yourself, using the TSS and TSC monitor commands?

    One note: the level number is probably counted from 0.
    • 47: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime15 Oct 2010
     
    Krótki

    I'll try... But... I'm still understand it not so well... or... I understand it bad. So if you can help me please. If you have enough time and you wish it. Sorry for asking you.
    • 48: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime15 Oct 2010
     
    I tried but it's always "invalid command". I may be do something wrong. Can you tell me what I have to do?
    • 49:
       
      CommentAuthorPoklik
    • CommentTime15 Oct 2010
     
    Petenokor: Wartość ta znajduje się pod $AE. Pierwsza plansza to 0, druga to 1 itd. Po modyfikacji tej komórki pamiętaj, że musisz zginąć aby 'przeładować' planszę, ewentualnie przejść ją (ale wtedy zinkrementujesz licznik plansz).
    • 50: CommentAuthorPetenokor
    • CommentTime15 Oct 2010 zmieniony
     
    Poklik

    Thanks! It works! Thank you very much!

    So levels are counted in 16-system. After the 9th there is 0a and then till 0f then comes 10 that is real 17th.