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1. • 1: CommentAuthorilmenit
   • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 08:04 zmieniony

    
   @emkay - all your claims about others being "unfriendly jesters" and polluting threads apply to you. Can't you really see this? Why did you bring it here again in post #36? Just stop, find other hobby than bashing people who actually do stuff or go away, please.
2. • 2: CommentAuthorzbyti
   • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 11:04

    
   Imponuje mi podejście programistów Wonderboya, maksymalnie profesjonalne chociaż mowa o hobby.
3. • 3: CommentAuthorYaron Nir
   • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 13:04

    
   @too thank you kindly :)
4. • 4: CommentAuthoremkay
   • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 15:04 zmieniony

    
   Ilmenit , please, learn to read, then answer, thanks. Particulary your insults toward me were always based on some weird comprehension at your side. You put word into my mouth that I never wrote, and even more strange, you don't even think of correcting your mistakes.
5. • 5: CommentAuthoremkay
   • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 15:04 zmieniony

    
   If you have a sneak peak at the Prince of Persia game, you see the obvious problems.
   There are 3 different moving objects, some PM overlay is used, yet no priority correction for the PMg. It already goes down to yet 5-6fps.
   "Wonderboy" doesn't need that masking.... but there is a lot CPU used for the scrolling mechanics.
   Could be interesting to see 8 way scrolling plus about 7 moving objects including collision handling...
   
   7 Objects:
   1) The Protagonist
   2) "Axe"
   3) "Axe"
   4) enemy 1
   5) enemy 2
   6) enemy 3
   7) enemy 4
   
   Not to forget the animated "Goodies" and "Baddies" ...
   
   The Atari clearly can do this game, but things turn somewhere , if every free resource for moving objects is blown.
6. • 6:
      
     CommentAuthorJacques
   • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 19:04 zmieniony

    

   emkay:

   If you have a sneak peak at the Prince of Persia game, you see the obvious problems.
   There are 3 different moving objects, some PM overlay is used, yet no priority correction for the PMg. It already goes down to yet 5-6fps.
   

   
   
   You're either stupid, don't read carefully and can't do a division or like to defame the authors and spread a lie here with 5-6 FPS in PoP:
   
   
   
   

   rensoup@AtariAge:

   The frames per second is the TV's framerate/ the number of frames.
   
   So with 2 characters on screen and moving tiles we get between 50/7 and 50/5 = 7 to 10fps

   
   
   So it's 7 to 10 FPS, which coresponds with result of more powerful BBC Master:
   ->link<-
   
   
   Anyway, it's about Wonderboy, so let's keep fingers crossed you'll eat your hat when they finish it.
7. • 7: CommentAuthoremkay
   • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 19:04 zmieniony

    
   Jacques
   
   Good grieve.
   You Guys will never get it . If you can have "10 fps" on a still screen, you don't even get 2 moving objects on a scrolling screen.
   If you have a 25 fps scrolling screen, you have to update ALL moving objects to fit to 25 fps.
   The interleaved movement of 3 moving objects cannot be done interleaved on a scrolling screen. The objects will jitter.
8. • 8:
      
     CommentAuthorJacques
   • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 19:04 zmieniony

    
   For god's sake, is it a still screen above with the counter?!! It's prince, enemy and dropping floor and game involves no scrolling and it's 7-10 FPS, not 5-6 what you claimed, so you could at least admit being wrong.
   EOT.
9. • 9: CommentAuthoremkay
   • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 19:04

    
   Jacques
   
   It's not OT .
   You are not able to put one and one together.
   It doesn't matter if 5 or 10 fps were reachable.
   If you put a scrolling there, you could do 12-13 fps scrolling to Wonderboy, and it won't look smooth.
10. • 10:
       
      CommentAuthorJacques
    • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 19:04 zmieniony

     
    Forget it. You were complaining about PoP running at 5-6 fps which was a lie and had nothing to do with Wonderboy. Enough for me.
11. • 11: CommentAuthoremkay
    • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 20:04

     
    Jacques
    
    A lie ?
    Who knows what's real in a GIF Animation that has been posted on April 1st.
12. • 12: CommentAuthorzbyti
    • CommentTime2 Apr 2020 21:04 zmieniony

     
    
    
    EDIT:
    No chyba, że są sporo lepsi od nas to wtedy zaoszczędzimy czas by nie iść złą ścieżką ;)
13. • 13:
       
      CommentAuthorpopmilo
    • CommentTime3 Apr 2020 22:04

     
    @Emkay I'll just answer to your " but there is a lot CPU used for the scrolling mechanics."
    
    75% of frames I only change 1 byte to scroll screen by one pixel.
    25% of frames I change 26 bytes... Difference in cpu time between static screen and scrolling screen is around 1-2 rasterlines...
    
    So, no - scrolling isn't a bottleneck. Drawing soft sprites is. But we proved even with unoptimized Sumo revenge that it can be done. And we did it in cc65 :)
    
    So, no, I'm not worried about that...
14. • 14:
       
      CommentAuthorpopmilo
    • CommentTime3 Apr 2020 22:04

     
    Dziękuję Zbyti :)
15. • 15: CommentAuthoremkay
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 09:04

     
    popmilo
    
    "unoptimized Sumo's Adventure" ?
    
    
    If you take this as a proof , I'll doubt it even more, that Wonderboy could reach "Arcade quality" using your aimed mechanics for the graphics. .
    The only object that is moving diagonal is the Yamo. All other elements move horizontally OR vertically. Not to tell that there is no background calculation.
    In that case, the update for the scrolling isn't problematic.
    But in Wonderboy many objects move "freely" also diagonal and independent from the scrolling speed.
    Also, "Sumo" looks like standard programming. Which means some PMg for the Protagonist and typically scrolling mechanics.
    How can that be a proof?
16. • 16: CommentAuthorilmenit
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 10:04

     
    Even if Wonderboy or PoP is finished, emkay will still bash the project because of lacking "arcade quality", like he did a few posts back talking about "Time Pilot". And even if you explain to him that what he is telling is bullshit (like the scrolling impact with the used DLI approach), he will later say he never said it and you put words in his mouth. But if you follow his advises, that would be totally different story! ;)
17. • 17: CommentAuthorzbyti
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 12:04 zmieniony

     
    Po prostu kolega nie ma kompleksów co też bywa cechą ignorantów ;)
    
    Wielu programistów pisze mu wprost, że nie postrzega go za osobę na ich poziomie ale on ma odmienne zdanie.
    
    Programista PoP oraz programiści Wonderboya nie reagują jednak gwałtownie na jego wpisy, jak mają ochotę to merytorycznie zbijają argumenty.
    
    Dla mnie, jako śledzącego takie rozmowy, to większa korzyść niż czytanie po raz n-ty, że jest hejterem - zauważyłem to :]
18. • 18: CommentAuthoremkay
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 12:04 zmieniony

     
    Things get interesting when Ilmenit starts to argue.
    If I am wrong with everything, why is his new game using character mode resolution ?
    Even better is how he moves reality to his own point of view.
    
    @zbyte
    So I'm a hater , because I'd like to see stuff finished on the Atari? Also very interesting view of things.
19. • 19: CommentAuthorzbyti
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 12:04 zmieniony

     
    @emkay
    Not because of that, but because of the method you choose.
20. • 20: CommentAuthoremkay
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 12:04

     
    @zbyti
    
    So it would be better to do it in the solo/ng way?
    No, I don't do so. To me all people have different talents. If everyone is doing his part, things will get done on and on.
    But, if everyone was like him, tomorrow all chaos will break out, because no one is accepting the other.
    I'm still about technical facts and given examples.
    Or is the true part that hurts?
    If I hadn't given so much examples of how things could be done, I'd understand that people projecting a "Troll" toward me. And now I'm a hater ;)
    
    But , if people want to understand things wrong, they only could change that for themselves.
    Particular the part where I wrote in other threads that there are too many jesters at AtariAge. I also wrote what that was meaning.
    I write it here once again, but I'm pretty sure it is better to yell into an empty space...
    
    There are a lot Coders (coming from other platforms ) who are interested into doing stuff for the Atari for any case. They get influenced by those jesters who don't know nothing about computers and the available resources. They don't allow technical discussions, and get personal. Then the Coders start coding, and get mislead listening to the jesters.
    Coders who know their stuff , wouldn't ask in such forums for information.
    
    ...
    
    
    Ilmenit for example used to prefer to read "all Atari Coders are Jesters" from that.
21. • 21:
       
      CommentAuthorCOR/ira4
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 13:04 zmieniony

     
    ...if someone is coding something, he should do it all by himself or with people who have been participating in the project from the beginning.
    

    Even if Wonderboy or PoP is finished, emkay will still bash the project because of lacking "arcade quality"

    
    something like "Rick the Dangerous";) ?
    we argue about two frames of animation ?!, I understand as if there were four, but in the video it looks good.
22. • 22: CommentAuthorzbyti
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 15:04 zmieniony

     

    emkay:

    So it would be better to do it in the solo/ng way?
    

    
    I don't think so. But he has his own style ;)
    
    I'm not moderator here. If he likes throw shit on you it is his point of view.
23. • 23: CommentAuthorheaven6502
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 16:04

     
    I love it...
    
    "They get influenced by those jesters who don't know nothing about computers and the available resources. They don't allow technical discussions, and get personal. Then the Coders start coding, and get mislead listening to the jesters."
    
    haha.... it seems you are the almighty and have the wisdom. thanks for sharing to us... from now on I call you Admirandus - the white wizard...
    
    I am not worthy... I am not worthy... oh Master...
24. • 24: CommentAuthorzbyti
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 16:04

     
    
25. • 25:
       
      CommentAuthorCOR/ira4
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 17:04

     
    @niebo6502
    ... and say only the word and your soul will be damned;)
26. • 26: CommentAuthoremkay
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 19:04

     
    heaven6502
    
    Wer sich den Schuh anzieht, dem passt er auch.
    
    What's so hard to understand there?
    There are "Atarifans" who just want things. And while they don't know about the limits, they still want "more". A Coder who is new to the Atari is asking for informations and gets flying unicorns.
    
    Have a look at "Atari Blast" this program is running the Atari at the far outer limits and Paul Lay did a lot Tricks to have it finished. There is no bit left to go further more into that direction, but people mailed me about "upgrading" the game.
    I wonder what they'd expect?
    A streaming game from cartridge?
    If people want to watch a movie they could use the TV or some Internet-Service.
27. • 27: CommentAuthorheaven6502
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 19:04

     
    ah... did I miss something? I can not find you in the credits of AtariBlast?
28. • 28:
       
      CommentAuthorCOR/ira4
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 19:04

     
    @emkay
    

    Gra strumieniowa z kartridża?
    Jeśli ludzie chcą obejrzeć film, mogą skorzystać z telewizora lub usługi internetowej.

    
    and why not ?, after all "Dragon's Lair" is great, and thanks to that Atari could be played in "Mad Dog" and other filmmakers.
29. • 29: CommentAuthoremkay
    • CommentTime4 Apr 2020 20:04

     
    heaven6502
    
    I asked Paul not to put me there. I didn't do much. Just some "beta" testing and the "new" tunes.
30. • 30: CommentAuthorsolo/ng
    • CommentTime5 Apr 2020 23:04 zmieniony

     
    [not worth it]
31. • 31: CommentAuthorAdam
    • CommentTime6 Apr 2020 02:04

     

    heaven6502:

    I can not find you in the credits of AtariBlast?

    
    In the first published version of "AtariBlast!" there was only one reused tune for the whole game (which was strongly criticised by many players). Then there was published version with many tracks - initially without explaining who prepared them (and without mention in the credits). Finally it was revealed that they were prepared by Emkay.
32. • 32:
       
      CommentAuthorKaz
    • CommentTime6 Apr 2020 21:04

     
    Wonderboy WIP looks great!